When you came in as the president of the NLC, you promised that workers’ welfare would be the cornerstone of your activities. How would you say you have fared?
Towards the end of Abacha’s tenure, the NLC was dissolved. General Abacha government promulgated three decrees, all of which were aimed at disqualifying me from being eligible to contest for the post of president of NLC. And that was because, while I was deputy to Paschal Bafyau, the security agencies knew exactly who was who. And when Abacha died, we had a government that decided to create a level playing-field. The first challenge was to rebuild the image of the NLC. We did promise that we would build a congress that Nigerians would appreciate and that we would build a congress that cannot be ignored by government and one that would take orders not from the State House, but from the rank and file of workers. And we also promised that it would be a congress that no employer of labour would ignore. I believe that seven and a half years later, it is not in contention that the NLC, under our stewardship, has overcome the crisis of confidence, which afflicted it.  Today there is no doubt that the 37 governments, including the federal government, treat NLC with respect. They may not like our face, but they can’t dispute the fact that we have been a major player. I think the same is also valid for employers of labour in the private sector. And the level of participation in the protests that we have organised, whether it was on furniture allowance that the legislators pocketed or a general strike to protest fuel hike, for the first time in Nigerian history, workers and non-workers, including self-employed people, teamed up with the NLC to protest.

In specific terms, how would you say your efforts have affected the lives of workers?
My first responsibility as NLC president was to convince the military administrators that they can implement a minimum wage of N3,000. The minimum wage before then was about N900. We got it to N2,500 for states and N3,000 for federal employees. We made the point then that, if we didn’t get the military to implement it, we would not have any basis to harass the civilian governments that were likely to succeed them. But, as we speak today, we not only succeeded in getting the military to implement the new minimum wage, we prevailed on President Obasanjo that he had to address the crisis of compensation and build on his own commitment to anti-corruption, that you could not fight corruption if you pay people less than they need to survive. The laws of nature dictate that they would devise copious strategies to survive and part of those strategies may border on corruption. Today, I am proud to say that the minimum pay in the federal civil service is N7,500, and in some states N6,500. In terms of where we were and where we are now a lot has changed.

You say some significant changes, which make you proud, have taken place. What is your own assessment of the Nigerian worker today?
What were those things a worker could afford by 1998 when the minimum wage was N900 or N800? What was it that he could afford to buy: the quality, the number of chickens? We are talking statistics now, facts. How many chickens could the least paid worker afford to buy: how many bags of rice would the minimum wage cover? You can use those indices. But, even if you do, you will find that, overall, the worker is better today than he was at that time. If we talk of a living wage…